I *strongly* disagree with the statement:
"as long as you don't try to make a profit off of the logo itself, Mitch isn't going to care if you choose to use it"
When I was going through the planning stages of the "East Coast LetterBoxing Meet/Greet" I asked about using the logo, and after many exchanged e-mails was basically told no. The reasoning was that LBNA *proper* was not hosting the evetn, I was, therefore LBNA did not want to be associated as being the *sponsor/host* of the event.
I understand the copyright restrictions, and if you get permission that you can use it how the permission is granted to you. HOwever, I strongly getting any permission in writing with a real signature affixed to the *permission slip*.
Not trying to cause controversy here....just my $.02
NewBe1
9F 8P 23X 1HH 1T
Kristoffer J Buquet
NewBe1@GlobalLetterBoxing.org
www.GlobalLetterBoxing.org
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http://groups.yahoo.com/group/globalletterboxing
"This list was created to be an outlet to spread the sport of LetterBoxing to all corners of the globe. LetterBoxing started in Dartmoor, England in the mid 1800's, moved to the USA in 1998, and will hopefully continue to spread around the world. I invite you to use this forum to spark your artisitc side, test your stamina for the outdoors, and enjoy nature as mother nature intended us to. "
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LBNA logo....BE CAREFUL
5 messages in this thread |
Started on 2002-11-11
Re: [LbNA] LBNA logo....BE CAREFUL
From: Kris Buquet (NewBe1@GlobalLetterBoxing.org) |
Date: 2002-11-11 15:26:51 UTC-07:00
Re: [LbNA] LBNA logo....BE CAREFUL
From: Randy Hall (randy@mapsurfer.com) |
Date: 2002-11-11 18:19:40 UTC-05:00
> The reasoning was that LBNA *proper* was not hosting the evetn, I was,
> therefore LBNA did not want to be associated as being the *sponsor/host*
> of the event.
(disclaimer -- IANAL and this is not legal advice or opinion)
What is "LbNA proper"?
Who, other than the creator of the artwork and name has the authority
to grant or deny this permission? Its just a word and a piece of
artwork. No corpus. How can "LBNA" sponsor/host an event? If Mitch
said no, that may or may not have been valid. If anyone else said no,
you were mislead ... (at least as to who has authority to say no)
(but it sounds as tho you should be careful, because someone sounds
protective of this stuff. BTW, I created the name "Letterboxing North
America" and placed it in the public domain _after_ the logo was created --
that shows how much I care -- but my IP is reflected in the logo -- so I
prolly co-own the rights to it, if someone somewhere is trying to turn
this into some sort of ******* contest :-))
> Not trying to cause controversy here....just my $.02
Nor I, just trying to clarify. This stuff was all developed in a community
spirit, so we should all just be able to use it. Your gathering, tho I
wasn't there, seemed to be in that spirit ...
Cheers
Randy
Re: [LbNA] LBNA logo....BE CAREFUL
From: (mohmers@aol.com) |
Date: 2002-11-11 20:03:46 UTC-05:00
In a message dated 11/11/02 2:27:51 PM Pacific Standard Time, NewBe1@GlobalLetterBoxing.org writes:
You're right! I was thinking the question was concerning making your own personal patch or T-shirt logo that included the LbNA logo in it. Sponsorship would be more sticky.
:o)
Mohmers
When I was going through the planning stages of the "East Coast LetterBoxing Meet/Greet" I asked about using the logo, and after many exchanged e-mails was basically told no. The reasoning was that LBNA *proper* was not hosting the evetn, I was, therefore LBNA did not want to be associated as being the *sponsor/host* of the event.
You're right! I was thinking the question was concerning making your own personal patch or T-shirt logo that included the LbNA logo in it. Sponsorship would be more sticky.
:o)
Mohmers
Re: LBNA logo....BE CAREFUL
From: ribnag (ribnag@entropy.tmok.com) |
Date: 2002-11-11 22:53:18 UTC-05:00
First, no one should take this "badly". If in doubt,
I mean whatever sounds offensive in a very light tone.
I consider this a fun hobby, a way to learn about new
hikes and perhaps even meet people. Arguing about
who can do what COMPLETELY misses the point.
> I understand the copyright restrictions, and if you
> get permission that you can use it how the permission
> is granted to you. HOwever, I strongly getting any
> permission in writing with a real signature affixed
> to the *permission slip*.
Let me get this straight... We trespass (public locations,
but used in a manner unknown to and sometimes deliberately
antagonistic to the wishes of the official owners), arguably
vandalize and/or litter, and tamper with historical sites
(doesn't matter if you leave the box in the middle of an
open lawn, technically we tamper), and people worry about
enforcement of the copyright on the LBNA logo?
Anyway...
I thought we had already posted this, but I don't see it
in the archive, so: RIBNAG publishes all of its material
under the GPL FDL, about which you can find more info at
http://www.gnu.org/licenses/licenses.html#FDL
In message 6286, Randy released the name "Letterboxing
North America" into the public domain.
In message 6433, Eric Mings placed the entire
letterboxing.com site into the public domain.
In message 1619, we learn that Dan considers clues AND
STAMPS residing on the letterboxing.org site as public
domain.
While Mitch expressed a difference of opinion on the
last point, we can basically consider *either* stance
moot, due to the very similar issue of "who owns Yahoo
list content?"... Namely, Yahoo (though they officially
disclaim ownership, they reserve the unconditional
right to use any posted content, including files and
pictures, however they want). If they decide to sell a
book containing all *our* posts for some strange reason,
they don't have to ask our permission or pay us a dime.
Posting to this list counts as implied consent. Or to
put it another way, the kids may argue who gets the candy,
but the parents can still take it away regardless of who
wins.
Checking the Files and Photos sections on our list, I
see...
That we can all stop bickering. We can either accept
that most of the body of letterboxing-oriented material
has effectively entered the public domain via Yahoo, or
we can look forward to an eventual schism that won't
benefit *ANY* of us.
Since people care so much about making this hobby
horribly complicated, I would suggest we all make
clear the copyright status of our work. For those
of us who consider this "fun" and don't really want
to bother with the hassle of all this ownership
crap, I would recommend the GPL FDL. For everyone
else, you have every right to make your work as
restrictive as possible, but don't shoot yourselves
in the foot (feet?).
Tell 'ya what - If Mitch gives an official statement that
we can't use his logo, I'll honor it. I will then proceed
to commission any of several artist friends to produce
something functionally identical but compositionally
different, and put it under the GPL FDL along with the
rest of RIBNAG's content, and you can all use *that* to
your hearts' delight. I seriously do not expect to have
to do that, I have always believed Mitch feels the same
as the rest of us and does this for enjoyment, not
possible future profit. And for that I thank him, and
all the other gods-of-letterboxing who make the American
version of this hobby possible.
But lighten up, people. If you stopped having fun,
find a new hobby. If not, get away from the computer
and hit the trails.
- Ben of RIBNAG
I mean whatever sounds offensive in a very light tone.
I consider this a fun hobby, a way to learn about new
hikes and perhaps even meet people. Arguing about
who can do what COMPLETELY misses the point.
> I understand the copyright restrictions, and if you
> get permission that you can use it how the permission
> is granted to you. HOwever, I strongly getting any
> permission in writing with a real signature affixed
> to the *permission slip*.
Let me get this straight... We trespass (public locations,
but used in a manner unknown to and sometimes deliberately
antagonistic to the wishes of the official owners), arguably
vandalize and/or litter, and tamper with historical sites
(doesn't matter if you leave the box in the middle of an
open lawn, technically we tamper), and people worry about
enforcement of the copyright on the LBNA logo?
Anyway...
I thought we had already posted this, but I don't see it
in the archive, so: RIBNAG publishes all of its material
under the GPL FDL, about which you can find more info at
http://www.gnu.org/licenses/licenses.html#FDL
In message 6286, Randy released the name "Letterboxing
North America" into the public domain.
In message 6433, Eric Mings placed the entire
letterboxing.com site into the public domain.
In message 1619, we learn that Dan considers clues AND
STAMPS residing on the letterboxing.org site as public
domain.
While Mitch expressed a difference of opinion on the
last point, we can basically consider *either* stance
moot, due to the very similar issue of "who owns Yahoo
list content?"... Namely, Yahoo (though they officially
disclaim ownership, they reserve the unconditional
right to use any posted content, including files and
pictures, however they want). If they decide to sell a
book containing all *our* posts for some strange reason,
they don't have to ask our permission or pay us a dime.
Posting to this list counts as implied consent. Or to
put it another way, the kids may argue who gets the candy,
but the parents can still take it away regardless of who
wins.
Checking the Files and Photos sections on our list, I
see...
That we can all stop bickering. We can either accept
that most of the body of letterboxing-oriented material
has effectively entered the public domain via Yahoo, or
we can look forward to an eventual schism that won't
benefit *ANY* of us.
Since people care so much about making this hobby
horribly complicated, I would suggest we all make
clear the copyright status of our work. For those
of us who consider this "fun" and don't really want
to bother with the hassle of all this ownership
crap, I would recommend the GPL FDL. For everyone
else, you have every right to make your work as
restrictive as possible, but don't shoot yourselves
in the foot (feet?).
Tell 'ya what - If Mitch gives an official statement that
we can't use his logo, I'll honor it. I will then proceed
to commission any of several artist friends to produce
something functionally identical but compositionally
different, and put it under the GPL FDL along with the
rest of RIBNAG's content, and you can all use *that* to
your hearts' delight. I seriously do not expect to have
to do that, I have always believed Mitch feels the same
as the rest of us and does this for enjoyment, not
possible future profit. And for that I thank him, and
all the other gods-of-letterboxing who make the American
version of this hobby possible.
But lighten up, people. If you stopped having fun,
find a new hobby. If not, get away from the computer
and hit the trails.
- Ben of RIBNAG
Re: [LbNA] LBNA logo....BE CAREFUL
From: (Fireflylight@aol.com) |
Date: 2002-11-11 23:56:54 UTC-05:00
In a message dated 11/11/02 8:04:18 PM Eastern Standard Time, mohmers@aol.com writes:
And that's actually why I was asking - was thinking of the tee shirt idea...
Coleen
"Firefly"
You're right! I was thinking the question was concerning making your own personal patch or T-shirt logo that included the LbNA logo in it. Sponsorship would be more sticky.
:o)
Mohmers
And that's actually why I was asking - was thinking of the tee shirt idea...
Coleen
"Firefly"